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Slam-Cut
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Joined: 09/07/2011

OK I'll bite. What are Audio Units?

Galaxyexplorer (not verified)

@Slam-Cut: You make a joke or?
If not..... Apple finally will inculde a full plug-in-model in iOS 9. Similar like it works in Logic and other DAW's. Still not sure if they allow several intances of one Audio Unit. Now you can open the UI from an Audio Unit inside your DAW (if it supports it of course). No need for Audiobus or IAA. Audio Units plug-ins can be sold in the app store too finally. Also they say that ports from OS X (or otherwise) should be easy..... still don't trust apple but at least it will grow ;)

Slam-Cut
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Joined: 09/07/2011

No, but I thought that you might be making a joke. Ha! Neither of us had a punch line.

I truely didn't know what an Audio Unit was. I know what VSTs are. I dabbled in computer sequencing in the late 90's, but mostly used the sequencer on the Ensoniq SD1. Then I disappeared from music for 12 years and currently I am only iOS oriented. I don't know what the world of PC DAWs is like anymore. I procrastinate on getting back into the PC world, hoping that NS2 with MIDI out will help. Maybe Auria Pro will help when it comes out. Just a thought, is Audio Unit a Mac term for VSTs?

You are ahead of us on the rumors of iOS 9 features, and it sounds like you bring good news. I agree with you doubt of Apple, but it makes me think I see a possible use of Alchemy as an Audio Unit inside of Garage Band. Probably Apple will makes us pay for Alchemy all over again, but it is at least something to hope for.

Stiksi
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Joined: 11/21/2010

"Still not sure if they allow several intances of one Audio Unit."

Yes, they do.

"Just a thought, is Audio Unit a Mac term for VSTs? "

No, it's not. It's a competing platform, which arguably works better on the mac. Most notable plugins come as both an AU and a VST. Think WAV and AIFF.

Slam-Cut
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Joined: 09/07/2011

Ah ha! That explains it. Never owned a MAC.
I shall commence to cheering for the new developments in iOS.
Matt will likely need something for the headaches the new features of iOS cause him. :o/

Blip Interactive
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Joined: 04/05/2010

Yes I heard about this. I haven't really researched it yet, but it'd be nice to hear some news that life just got simpler rather than another potential system to support! My main question is about how relevant Audiobus will be on iOS 9. Is it now going to be possible to reduce down to IAA + AU?

Blip Interactive
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Joined: 04/05/2010

OK I've conducted my 60 seconds research. It seems that host apps will be able to present the UI of an AU extension so it's actually integrated into the host app, in the same way a desktop DAW contains the UI of a VST plugin. This is a big step forward from the whole Audiobus/background app switching pain.

Galaxyexplorer (not verified)

@Blip Interactive: I recommend to watch the WWDC video from the apple site about the Audio Unit extensions. It's about an hour... Also the WWDC video about core audio news could be interesting. Now you can sell me an Audio Unit NanoStudio (2) in the mac store ;D I would pay 99€ for sure..... think about it.

@Slam-Cut: Garage Band seems to get an update with Audio Units with iOS 9 and Garage Band for mac will get an update at the end of this month which include Alchemy like remix pads for the synths. They call it "transform pad" and you can morph between 8 different FX settings or morph trough different character of a sound etc. This is for sure the first Camel Audio tech included in Garage Band. Not sure if and when the iOS version will get it too. I hope for something more in Logic Pro X soon too. Mostly they use Garage Band as testplatform before bringing an advanced version of this into Logic..... we will see.

At least this all could make it happen that we finally can use DAW's and plug-ins like on desktops today in a few years. Still wish they go for OS X touch since the data management is still crap in iOS and it is STILL a smartphone OS!

Greetings ;)

ElectricWombat
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Joined: 01/16/2015

Wow... It's all very exciting news - it's wonderful to hear about such an epic step forward for IOS music making, thanks for all the info it sounds awesome can't wait:)

Galaxyexplorer (not verified)

Eden 2 as Audio Unit..... Matt needs more staff ;)

Slam-Cut
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Joined: 09/07/2011

Just in case the thought occurs, I wouldn't think that dropping Audiobus support entirely in NS2 would be wise. If it ain't broke don't fix it sort of thing.

ElectricWombat
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Joined: 01/16/2015

I would imagine Mike Tyson (AudioBus not the boxing dude) to potentially absorb the 'AU' format into AB in some creative way (i.e. attaching lots of AU plugins into multiple audio pipelines outside the limitations of any single host software etc).

I could still see AB being relevant and continue to be used and expanded etc - but I guess we'll have to see! Everybody already owns it anyway, perhaps he might implement his new 'amazing MIDI engine' into it as an IAP or something. Dam it's punishing having to wait until September for AU/IOS 9 to be introduced! :)

tom_tm
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Joined: 06/29/2011

Slam-cut!!! Hold your tongue!!! 'If it ain't broke don't fix it'??? Are you serious? This is broke and this *is* fixing it!!

Please drop Audiobus in favour of AU!! AB is just so fucking shite!! Audiobus was a cobbled together workaround for not having AU’s in iOS. AU's are the absolute bomb! Like Stiksi absolutely correctly stated, AU's are completely where it's at as far as Mac's and OSX are concerned. A VST was a system that Steinberg came up with for Cubase. It works okay, but it's no Audio Unit.

Funnily enough I did see a whole bunch of people moaning about not having VST's in iOS somewhere on the net (!!!). It's almost as if they don't get that iOS and OSX/Windows are two (or three) separate things. IOS is not PC class, but with the speeds of newer iPad's, iPad's are not that far off. But they are still two completely different things.

As for Nanostudio 2 as an AU? I've already creamed my knickers. 8-)

Slam-Cut
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Joined: 09/07/2011

Your creamy knickers aside, I don't argue agaist AU, in fact I've been for it (in concept) since I had a 3gs, but I just know that all apps won't be updated to work as AUs in a timely manner, and we will have to use AB for a while on some old apps, like Sunrizer XS for example. That doesn't work on my iPhone with 8.1.3, so I assume that it is either not being updated at all or only very slowly. I can use it on my iPad, but if NS2 dropped AB and Sunrizer doesnt work as an AU because it hasn't been updated, then I'm screwed. I'm all in favor of phasing in AU, but not dropping AB until it is useless. Just my 2 cents.

ElectricWombat
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Joined: 01/16/2015

Creamy knickers... Eeeeeew! Sounds like you have an epic yeast infection :0

@Tom_tm major overshare, but the sentiment was captured! ;) Based on Apples track record (IAA), I would expect it will take some time for AU to be adopted and stable (tentative steps) but I agree with Slam-Cut, there will be many much loved legacy products that will likely continue to rely on AB, but having a solution in place while a better solution takes shape sounds like a good idea to me! It's great news anyway and it will be interesting to see how it evolves etc.

@Slam-Cut; you say Sunrizer XS doesn't work on your iPhone with IOS 8.3? That's harsh - which version of iPhone is it? I'm running it on an iPhone 4s and it works fine (although there's bugs) and the developer seems to have essentially abandoned the existing issues in Sunrizer XS and Impaktor sadly. I keep a bug list but his site/forum is like a demilitarised ghost town so I haven't bothered contacting him about them as yet.

Galaxyexplorer (not verified)

And don't forget that we will get split view screen (and real multitasking) for the first time (without jail break)... but just for iPad Air 2 and above. This all sounds good but i'm scared about new bugs in iOS 9 and still a useless folder system and copy/paste crap. Still after years we are far away from the good old sonoma copy/paste....WTF! I also think (at least for my needs) that the CPU and RAM is still too far away for using all this things like i want (he he). Would be interesting if we see an iPad Pro this fall. I could use it as great controller and to record stuff into Logic. I finally realize that i just can use this booth things together instead of searching for the ONE thing. I just hope that the beta software called iOS will someday work better again. OS X (and Logic) is also full of bugs. I know, i must forget the times where things just work...... in the past everything was better..... confirmed.... i'm an old fart :D

Slam-Cut
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Joined: 09/07/2011

@ElectricWombat: "Fortunately I keep my feathers numbered for just such an occassion."

I have a 6+ 128 GB running 8.1.3 and Sunrizer XS just vanishes when I try to press anything. However, I kept my 4s 64GB and my old 3gs which run Sunrizer just fine. I think I'll stick the 3gs in my old SS25 and use it as a dedicated 'hardware' Sunrizer XS synth. I'm just starting to dust off my old MIDI gear and set up a music studio. My old iDevices will have a second life as MIDI synths. The weird part will be using those old 2 line displays on the sound modules. Seems so ancient after getting used to iPhone and iPad displays...

ElectricWombat
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Joined: 01/16/2015

No way, I didn't realise it doesn't work on the new 6+ that's terrible! I know he turned his attention to producing a desktop version of Sunrizer; but you'd have thought keeping the old one working should have been a priority too - dam!

Sounds like a really good idea to use your old phones as 'hardware synth' modules; an unbelievable feat to imagine many years ago when some of the old said MIDI modules were current etc. Yeh I know exactly what you mean regarding the old style backlit green LCD displays, they seem so quaint (and retro) now he he...

Ironically even the latest $6000+ Cannon cameras still use that antiquitied technology (on top) seems utterly bizarre! A dude from a YouTube photography show I watch (Tony Northrop) is always ripping them for it lol. Actually it totally reminds me of my ancient Nokia brick phone R.I.P (I really don't miss that thing) ha ha :)

tom_tm
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Joined: 06/29/2011

I love this community! Haha! <3 :D

ElectricWombat
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Joined: 01/16/2015

"I love this community! Haha! <3 :D"

He he... Me too ;)

Slam-Cut
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Joined: 09/07/2011

I'm sure that it is not the 6+ that is the problem, but iOS 8. I guess the sad thing is that I haven't gone out on the web to search for a solution - i just assume that it is changes in the iOS that broke a perfectly good app. That also gives me a bit of trepidation at the future of some of my beloved apps. Alchemy comes to mind. How long until that one no longer works? iOS 9 maybe? Any app could fall prey to Apple's 'progress', and I wonder, at night, when I'm all alone and the darkness envelops me, what will happen to NS? What if...? Then I stop. I can't even think it. Too scary!

Sunrizer works on my iPad Air w/iOS 8.3, but Sunrizer XS is a no go on iPhone 6+ w/8.1.3
Anyone got a clue about this or heard if an update is in the works?

Stiksi
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Joined: 11/21/2010

@ ElectricWombat: "Ironically even the latest $6000+ Cannon cameras still use that antiquitied technology (on top) seems utterly bizarre!"

Those cameras are for people, who shoot day after day all day, frequently in tough conditions, and really appreciate saving battery life for getting a dozen shots more. Colour costs money and battery life and TBH what does a text display gain from full colour? Nikon and Sony both use the same top LCDs too. They show up well in the dark and in full sunlight, hot or cold, and do their job with total reliability. Monochrome LCD is the best tech for the job so far.

ElectricWombat
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Joined: 01/16/2015

Hey @Stiksi, you raise some really good points, and I agree with your opinion(s) 100%; but often things are left as they are; merely as a relic of technology past rather than an ongoing need. The top LCD displays have no ability to present anything other than basic alpha numeric data so they merely reiterate aperture, shooting speed etc (exact same info on the main display and via the viewfinder) which is somewhat redundant/unnecessary.

I just figure at some stage they'll finally catch up with this millennium and at least use a high density display to show some really useful info (assignable MACROS, at a glance/quick access features etc). There's just so much you could do with an additional display on a DSLR that it seems such a waste to reiterate redundant info!

However, then again I am utterly obsessed with the evolution of technology; and it's always easy to poke fun at Cannon (which I use I might add) as they're financial rapists and all they seem to have done since remarkably inventing the DSLR film revolution is fall behind and play catch up ever since which is frustrating as hell! :(

ElectricWombat
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Joined: 01/16/2015

@Slam-Cut, yeh it's wierd that Sunrizer XS works fine on my iPhone 4s with IOS 8.3, but not on the iPhone 6+ and it's such a shame as it would look awesome on that huge screen! It will be running 32 bit compatability mode on my 4s so it's possible the issue is to do with the 64 bit variant? Anyone tried it on the 5s/IOS 8.3?

As I say, it's developer - genius that he is - is really lazy with updates and bug fixing - Impaktor's full of them (as is Sunrizer XS) and I was so hoping that he'd bring it up to date with some new features etc (mainly the ability to post edit drum timing which is automatic). IOS 8.4 will be out in a couple of weeks (or less) if you're feeling brave perhaps it might work again lol!? :p

Slam-Cut
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Joined: 09/07/2011

It might be that my 6+ is still on 8.1.3, and maybe it would work on 8.3. I don't know enough to make an assessment, and it feels like every time I update the iOS I am actually playing Russian Roulette with my apps. One would think that if it works on your 4s with 8.3, then it should work on a 6+. Hmm.

ElectricWombat
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Joined: 01/16/2015

Hey @Slam-Cut, I'm really sorry (had a dumb ass moment), I only just clocked that you mentioned IOS 8.1.3 and not IOS 8.3 (they're similar so I can be forgiven) ;)

In that case that will likely be it! Well I just figure you've already made the jump to IOS 8, there's no going back - so forward is the only way to move/advance! I've got a very don't care/what ever attitude about upgrading, so at least you have me as an 'IOS guinee pig/lab rat' to test the water!

Epilogue:
[ElectricWombat paddles out into the serene turquoise IOS ocean optimistically]
"...yes there 'were' sharks in there... Munch munch... Blop... Blip... Blop...!" :0

...Sick - ha ha ha ;)

Slam-Cut
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Joined: 09/07/2011

Crap! I didn't get back to the forum in time to toss a life preserver to you. By which I do mean the American 'life preserver' and not the British 'life preserver'/weapon. And for that matter 'tossing' as Yanks usually mean it and not the way most Brits might hear it. :o/

My first hesitation to get the iPhone on 8.3 came when I updated the iPad Air to 8.3 and Chrome didn't work. I prefer that over Safari, a lot. And I am far more likely to use my iPhone to surf the internet than the iPad. Although I do find it easier to keep my balance on the iPad, especially on the big waves. Google is huge, so I am sure they will get the glitches sorted out super fast, and they may already have done so. It's been a week. That's enough time for those guys. I'll check with my iPad. If Sunrizer XS does work on 8.3, I'd be really happy. I've missed that synth.

ElectricWombat
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Joined: 01/16/2015

Ha ha ha, the life preserver would only have made the Sharks take their time devouring me anyway (but thanks for the thought) ;) Yeh I've not installed Chrome on IOS, though I'm a big advocate of it on windows (IE = hiss/boo). As Matt mentioned elsewhere on the forum, Safari is currently seriously slow under IOS 8.3 (keeps on 'failing to load' when visiting sites) usually the ones I visit regularly like Strava, Amazon etc lol. Apple... You gotta love em [dot dot dot] :/

Yeh iPad's are wayyy easier to ride than iPhones, kinda relative to paddling out on a mini Malibu vs. a big wave short board ha ha ha ;) Yeh I know what you mean about the iPhone being the tool of choice for browsing, there's been many times I've been sat in front of a gorgeous humongous iMac and still been sat with my eyes glued to the tiny text on my iPhone. I think it's possibly because it's permanently screwed my vision so that I can only focus on 0.2 text now! :0(

Sunrizer/XS is truly wonderful, I haven't payed much attention to the desktop release but I assume it's going well. One thing I've never really mentioned before is that I'm almost certain it's modelled off the Novation Supernova (which I own) as there is so much similarity in the sounds it creates. This is also true of the 'Super Saw' waveform (which was one of the key selling points of the Supernova back in the day... Man it's even 'Blue' like the Novation Supernova... I'll have to ask the dev about this sometime! ;)

Stiksi
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Joined: 11/21/2010

@ ElectricWombat: but often things are left as they are; merely as a relic of technology past rather than an ongoing need.

Very, very true. And I do see your POV that you could do more with the top LCD, but as a (probably former) pro photog, that little LCD is the only view I get of ALL my settings in one screen, that I don't have to press ten buttons to access. And using the rear LCD sucks battery like a humvee, so I practically never use that in the field except to check my exposure at the lighting stage and focus at the end of a shoot.

The top LCD serves a critical function that is not the instant exposure and focus info I get from the viewfinder and not the double check function I get from the rear LCD. I get that it would be superfluous on an enthusiast-level camera that isn't intended to serve 3–15 straight hours at a time, but for me, the low battery impact and always-on nature of the top LCD are essential. Change that, and lose me as a customer.

So far, Nikon has served me well, except for that abysmal D200 that went through two batteries in as many hours. Had to carry two chargers everywhere even when I had a battery grip and two spares… They really only caught up to Canon by buying Sony's sensors, that was their weakness. AFAICS Nikon and Canon are pretty much neck and neck right now. Sony is coming up with cool tricks next month but their ergonomics are still weak.

Anyhow, Sunrizer XS works like a charm on my 5s with 8.3.

Slam-Cut
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Joined: 09/07/2011

Chrome now seems to be fine on iPad Air with iOS 8.3. Weird. I turn it off after every use, so I know it wasn't an issue of just turn off/turn on.
Looks like I should just try the 8.3 on the iPhone 6+. Scary...

Wish I had Stiksi's skill sets: computer graphics & pro photographer. Nice!